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	<title>Comments on: Language and the Internet</title>
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	<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/</link>
	<description>An Irreverent Look at the Glocalized World</description>
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		<title>By: El Oso &#187; Archive &#187; SA bloggers are thriving in cyberspace. They just aren&#8217;t nearly diverse enough.</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-239310</link>
		<dc:creator>El Oso &#187; Archive &#187; SA bloggers are thriving in cyberspace. They just aren&#8217;t nearly diverse enough.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Dec 2008 09:21:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-239310</guid>
		<description>[...] languages, however, have, comparably, only recently existed in written form. Unlike in Tanzania, where written Swahili was a significant and symbolic part of their independence movement, formal education in written indigenous South African languages has never really taken [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] languages, however, have, comparably, only recently existed in written form. Unlike in Tanzania, where written Swahili was a significant and symbolic part of their independence movement, formal education in written indigenous South African languages has never really taken [...]</p>
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		<title>By: El Oso, El Moreno, and El Abogado &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Inchiodati al volante</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-226939</link>
		<dc:creator>El Oso, El Moreno, and El Abogado &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Inchiodati al volante</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Dec 2007 02:30:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-226939</guid>
		<description>[...] (After doing a search on Internazionale, I see they translated a previous blog post of mine on Language and the Internet.) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] (After doing a search on Internazionale, I see they translated a previous blog post of mine on Language and the Internet.) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Global Voices amin&#39;ny teny Malagasy &#187; Blog Archive</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-226165</link>
		<dc:creator>Global Voices amin&#39;ny teny Malagasy &#187; Blog Archive</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Sep 2007 16:21:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-226165</guid>
		<description>[...] nanombohan’ny global online conversation no efa niadian-kevitra izay mety ho vokatsoa sy vokadratsy azo avy amin’ny fivoaran’ny haitaom-pampitam-baovao misy [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] nanombohan’ny global online conversation no efa niadian-kevitra izay mety ho vokatsoa sy vokadratsy azo avy amin’ny fivoaran’ny haitaom-pampitam-baovao misy [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Global Voices Online &#187; Blogging in Neo Patwa</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-226076</link>
		<dc:creator>Global Voices Online &#187; Blogging in Neo Patwa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Sep 2007 06:38:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-226076</guid>
		<description>[...] modern information technology has a positive or negative effect on global language diversity has been debated since the very beginning of the global online conversation. On the positive side, localized to fit [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] modern information technology has a positive or negative effect on global language diversity has been debated since the very beginning of the global online conversation. On the positive side, localized to fit [...]</p>
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		<title>By: ndesanjo</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-224473</link>
		<dc:creator>ndesanjo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 03:51:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-224473</guid>
		<description>When we look at languages as a tool of communication, english ends up being a very important language. I can communicate with David and other readers on his blog although we come from different parts of the world. But  language is also a bank of knoweldge (stories, myths, songs, sayings, names of plants and herbs, riddles, etc, ) This fact has convinced me to firmly believe in the importance of language preservation. Language is a site of collective consciousness. Some languages may be redundant because as communication tools as Msapere argued, but not when we look at them as knowledge banks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When we look at languages as a tool of communication, english ends up being a very important language. I can communicate with David and other readers on his blog although we come from different parts of the world. But  language is also a bank of knoweldge (stories, myths, songs, sayings, names of plants and herbs, riddles, etc, ) This fact has convinced me to firmly believe in the importance of language preservation. Language is a site of collective consciousness. Some languages may be redundant because as communication tools as Msapere argued, but not when we look at them as knowledge banks.</p>
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		<title>By: msapere</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-224433</link>
		<dc:creator>msapere</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2007 00:13:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-224433</guid>
		<description>[...]In fact, just like English, Spanish, and Russian, Swahili fits many of the characteristics of a ‘colonial language.’ [...]

anglo-phone and franco-phone influences on the African continent can directly be attributed to colonialism--and subsequently,  &#039;colonial language&#039;. However, lumping Kiswahili into this category raises a few questions. Was it actively used as a language of assimilation in its infancy? my ansser would be negative since it sprung up as a &#039;language of Trade&#039; NOT colonialism. following colonial language logic one would have to assume that a colonial power would want it&#039;s proper language, and not some hybrid to be the lingua franca. If Vasco Da Gama, and the Persian sultans had intentions of fully assimilating the occupied territory and it&#039;s peoples, then I&#039;d imagine that they wouldn&#039;t want a baturdized(sp) version of their National language(s) to spoken by the locals. the evidence of portuguese, Arabic, and/or Persian involvement in actively teaching their respective languages to the locals (subjects?) is lacking, while the evidence of intermingling--as well as intermarriages--of cultures brought on by trade (including slaves) abounds.

you could very well argue that Kiswahili is a language borne through pure capitalism. A unique characteristic in and of itself when compared to other languages.

As far as the preservation of lesser known/spoken African languages (and other languages in general), the future looks somber. but in my estimation most of these languages will assimilate into relative, larger languages. for example most bantu languages are redundant in my opinion. the Nilotic languages of the Maasai and Rendile tribes are so similar that the distinction between the two tribes can seldom be made by reference to their respective lanuages. this can be said of most other tribal dialects in Africa. what we are seeing now is the amalgamation of quasi-disparate languages. not a loss, but a net gain. this is the way it was before and during the first intra-continental African migration of the diaspora.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...]In fact, just like English, Spanish, and Russian, Swahili fits many of the characteristics of a ‘colonial language.’ [...]</p>
<p>anglo-phone and franco-phone influences on the African continent can directly be attributed to colonialism&#8211;and subsequently,  &#8216;colonial language&#8217;. However, lumping Kiswahili into this category raises a few questions. Was it actively used as a language of assimilation in its infancy? my ansser would be negative since it sprung up as a &#8216;language of Trade&#8217; NOT colonialism. following colonial language logic one would have to assume that a colonial power would want it&#8217;s proper language, and not some hybrid to be the lingua franca. If Vasco Da Gama, and the Persian sultans had intentions of fully assimilating the occupied territory and it&#8217;s peoples, then I&#8217;d imagine that they wouldn&#8217;t want a baturdized(sp) version of their National language(s) to spoken by the locals. the evidence of portuguese, Arabic, and/or Persian involvement in actively teaching their respective languages to the locals (subjects?) is lacking, while the evidence of intermingling&#8211;as well as intermarriages&#8211;of cultures brought on by trade (including slaves) abounds.</p>
<p>you could very well argue that Kiswahili is a language borne through pure capitalism. A unique characteristic in and of itself when compared to other languages.</p>
<p>As far as the preservation of lesser known/spoken African languages (and other languages in general), the future looks somber. but in my estimation most of these languages will assimilate into relative, larger languages. for example most bantu languages are redundant in my opinion. the Nilotic languages of the Maasai and Rendile tribes are so similar that the distinction between the two tribes can seldom be made by reference to their respective lanuages. this can be said of most other tribal dialects in Africa. what we are seeing now is the amalgamation of quasi-disparate languages. not a loss, but a net gain. this is the way it was before and during the first intra-continental African migration of the diaspora.</p>
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		<title>By: leahpeah</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-224432</link>
		<dc:creator>leahpeah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 May 2007 23:53:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-224432</guid>
		<description>has joe ever told you about his family? his grandparents purposely didn&#039;t teach their children (joe&#039;s mom) spanish. they thought it would be better if they were &#039;fully integrated&#039; into their new society, which, actually, was their old society but the border crossed over them and suddenly, it was the USA. i find it very interesting. and joe is interested in the spanish language either because of or in spite of that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>has joe ever told you about his family? his grandparents purposely didn&#8217;t teach their children (joe&#8217;s mom) spanish. they thought it would be better if they were &#8216;fully integrated&#8217; into their new society, which, actually, was their old society but the border crossed over them and suddenly, it was the USA. i find it very interesting. and joe is interested in the spanish language either because of or in spite of that.</p>
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		<title>By: logtar</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-224270</link>
		<dc:creator>logtar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 May 2007 14:52:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-224270</guid>
		<description>(As a side note, this is also what God does when she doesn’t want a relationship to work.)

Funniest quote of the week!

Quit hating LOLCATZ, the STILLZ RULE!

I think we should all learn like 4 languages each!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(As a side note, this is also what God does when she doesn’t want a relationship to work.)</p>
<p>Funniest quote of the week!</p>
<p>Quit hating LOLCATZ, the STILLZ RULE!</p>
<p>I think we should all learn like 4 languages each!</p>
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		<title>By: &#8230;My heart&#8217;s in Accra &#187; The survival of languages in a digital age</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-224266</link>
		<dc:creator>&#8230;My heart&#8217;s in Accra &#187; The survival of languages in a digital age</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 May 2007 13:50:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-224266</guid>
		<description>[...] Sasaki&#8217;s got a great post, in part in response to this post, which points out the Swahili will almost certainly survive in [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Sasaki&#8217;s got a great post, in part in response to this post, which points out the Swahili will almost certainly survive in [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick Hall</title>
		<link>http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/comment-page-1/#comment-224251</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Hall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 May 2007 07:55:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://el-oso.net/blog/archives/2007/05/17/language-and-the-internet/#comment-224251</guid>
		<description>Great post, David. 

I was interested in particular by your observations on just who should be doing the preserving of endangered languages: &quot;Why should I concern myself with the impending extinction of, say, Kurrama?&quot; Indeed. Not because Kurrama is somehow less valuable than any other language, but because Kurrama is no more valuable than any other language... all languages merit protection, but all of them can&#039;t be saved; it&#039;s a conundrum. 

On the one hand, if the speakers of the language don&#039;t wish to preserve the language, no external party has (or should have) the right to force them to do so; on the other hand, the loss of a language is a loss to science and humanity in general. (Imagine if &lt;a title=&quot;Pirahã language - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia&quot; href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piraha_language&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Pirahã&lt;/a&gt; had died out!)

There is a paper I&#039;ve been meaning to get my hands on by the late great &lt;a title=&quot;Peter Ladefoged - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia&quot; href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Ladefoged&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Peter Ladefoged&lt;/a&gt;  which pointed out that directing funds that could be used for development to language revitalization is morally questionable. A life is worth more than a language.

But of course these are just extreme examples. The reality is fuzzy and drenched with human motivations, passions, politics, and everything else. In some cases, perhaps many, maybe even most, I would guess that speakers of dying languages are eager to save them, and accept the help of outside experts.  It can be done with proper social and legal respect. But after having read a fair amount about revitalization efforts all over the world, my impression is that it&#039;s very difficult to generalize in a textbook manner about how to navigate the political realities of a particular language community.  (Techniques for actually _doing_ preservation work, once it&#039;s been decided that preservation should happen, however, have been described in a pretty impressive literature already -- googling Leanne Hinton will lead to some excellent introductions to that topic.) 

Sorry for rambling on... I think I might end up squeezing another blog post out of the thoughts your post has raised. ☺</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post, David. </p>
<p>I was interested in particular by your observations on just who should be doing the preserving of endangered languages: &#8220;Why should I concern myself with the impending extinction of, say, Kurrama?&#8221; Indeed. Not because Kurrama is somehow less valuable than any other language, but because Kurrama is no more valuable than any other language&#8230; all languages merit protection, but all of them can&#8217;t be saved; it&#8217;s a conundrum. </p>
<p>On the one hand, if the speakers of the language don&#8217;t wish to preserve the language, no external party has (or should have) the right to force them to do so; on the other hand, the loss of a language is a loss to science and humanity in general. (Imagine if <a title="Pirahã language - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piraha_language" rel="nofollow">Pirahã</a> had died out!)</p>
<p>There is a paper I&#8217;ve been meaning to get my hands on by the late great <a title="Peter Ladefoged - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Ladefoged" rel="nofollow">Peter Ladefoged</a>  which pointed out that directing funds that could be used for development to language revitalization is morally questionable. A life is worth more than a language.</p>
<p>But of course these are just extreme examples. The reality is fuzzy and drenched with human motivations, passions, politics, and everything else. In some cases, perhaps many, maybe even most, I would guess that speakers of dying languages are eager to save them, and accept the help of outside experts.  It can be done with proper social and legal respect. But after having read a fair amount about revitalization efforts all over the world, my impression is that it&#8217;s very difficult to generalize in a textbook manner about how to navigate the political realities of a particular language community.  (Techniques for actually _doing_ preservation work, once it&#8217;s been decided that preservation should happen, however, have been described in a pretty impressive literature already &#8212; googling Leanne Hinton will lead to some excellent introductions to that topic.) </p>
<p>Sorry for rambling on&#8230; I think I might end up squeezing another blog post out of the thoughts your post has raised. ☺</p>
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